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Steven, thanks for this forum and yes I am interested in a DC-15.

There seems to be some interest on this site about making a DC-15. I am in the process of organizing a HC-30 (DC-30 Head). My wanderings on the internet has me curious about this tube/circuit. It seems there is quite a following for this tube/circuit which has its origins in the AC30/4 and the AC15. Despite difficulties with micrphonics, noise, and durability issues, this tube/circuit seems very popular today. Matchless, Badcat and Dr. Z are three builders that currently use them. WHY?

Also there is some guy in Europe who converts Non-topboost JMI AC30's into AC30/4's. Sounds crazy to me to mod a vintage amp, but I guess the demand interest and curiosity in my case is strong.

The NOS tube venders post reviews of happy customers who solve their amps problems with expensive NOS tubes. Is there any truth to this and if there is what would the most desirable brand/era tube one would want?

Please post your own experiences and opinions.

I am in the process of building the three headed beast. One EF86, one Normal, and one TBoost into an AC15/Lightning/Spitfire output stage using Westlabs/Matchless trannies...(still working out phase dilemma)
You might want to go to the 18W board and inquire about Sgt Overdrive about the NOS toobs. He got me some badass NOS Telefunkens, Bells, Russkies, Mullards (incl '86s)
I personally heard these tubes A-B'd against JJs, Sovteks, etc....think fire, heat. the abyss, inferno......
I personally love the sound of EF86's
check out 65Amps.com....the 65 London sound clips

the ghost of Jack Parsons

_________________
the bastard son of Jack Parsons
http://www.rotten.com/library/bio/mad-s ... k-parsons/

The current Matchless company apparently caved to demand. The amp is called the Nighthawk, a 15 watter with EF-86 and six position tone switch and master. DC-15 sounds much cooler. (The Lightning is the triode channel of the DC-30, right? I haven't skimmed the schematics in a while.)

Bear

If the interest is there, I can set up a DC-15 forum. I'll watch for a while.

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Stephen
Web: www.trinityamps.com. Facebook: facebook.com/trinityamps. Twitter: @trinityamps

I think the DC-15 is definitely a hot ticket. Having the idea in mind, I'm putting off the notion of doing a Lightning - the DC-15 seems more like the total package. The Spitfire and the trem models stand alone as a bit more of their own thing. Not that the Lightning doesn't sound appealing as hell already, but it's just a little bit further to go to get everything but the extra 15 watts.

Bear

I agree. A DC15 would be a lot more versatile and not all that difficult to build for anyone who has already tackled a lightning.
Interesting note: that tone select sw in the DC30 seem to have come from the early Orange amps designs, although I've seen it in a 'shunt' LP filter topology in older toob mic pre designs...

boo!..........

_________________
the bastard son of Jack Parsons
http://www.rotten.com/library/bio/mad-s ... k-parsons/

Just to add: if one were to build this as a head w/ an EF86, there would be less prob w/ microphonics....unless you put it on top of spkr cabs...which I never personally have ever done.....only because R Fripp, Steve Hackett, and Dave Gilmour didn't....and I thought they had their reasons....

boo!......

_________________
the bastard son of Jack Parsons
http://www.rotten.com/library/bio/mad-s ... k-parsons/

One of the earliest bits of tube info I saw was an interview w/ tech Steve Wilson (SRV/Kentucky Headhunters) I think in Musician Magazine before it folded. He pointed out you've got all these little fragile glass bottles in there - why on earth would you put them on top of two 412's moving like jackhammers? And that's w/o consideration of having them in the backwave line of the speakers even. The combo is more convenient in several ways, but tube life isn't one of them.

(Kevin O'Connor also points out that the backwave tends not to be a problem in relatively low gain Fender combo's, but in high-gain, high-powered Boogies, it's a world of pain.)

There is the counter argument that in some designs, the speaker backwave hitting the tube can actually be a subtly good thing towards a sustain/feedback effect. Once you get a rattle or whistle from the tube, though, the fun seems to be over.

Bear

Stephen, I think anyone considering building a Lighning would consider the upgrade of the extra channel on a DC-15. I vote to start that new forum. Two differant channels are better than one. I'm also very interested in Chiefs amp with the bonus TB channel.

Might I also suggest that since many of us are concerned about the microphonic issues with the EF-86 that we might want to distinguish the head version by calling it the HC-15.

I have been brainstorming and got some O-rings to isolate my 9-pine tube sockets. One O-ring lays aroung the perimeter of a recess in the porcelin and others fit between the screws and chassis. The idea is to captivate the socket, but not snugly, using the rubber O-rings as dampening material. I've seen a similare design used on my 52 Fender Deluxe. Those old octal tubes also had problems with microphonics.

At work we have scales that weigh micro grams. They are very sensitive to vibration. Dampening is provided by using a heavey slab of stone that uses three rubber pads as dampers. I am considering mounting my EF-86 tube socket to a small square of brass to improve upon just using the above O-rings.

Is the Nighthawk a two channel amp? Or in other words; is it a Lighning with an added EF-86 channel?
Cal

CALZONE
I can send you a schematic if you'd like. No layout yet, as I'm just finishing up a bastardized JTM45/Chieftain for a friend and am still in the process of restoring a Vox Cambridge. It'll be awhile before I get started, but I'll post a layout when I get it done (w/ a dxf of turret layout). I have all the parts, just not enuf time

Lemme know if you want a gander at it

boo.......

_________________
the bastard son of Jack Parsons
http://www.rotten.com/library/bio/mad-s ... k-parsons/

That'd make too much sense. It's one from column A or one from column B. It's like they cut a DC-30 in half, half the watts and one pre in the Lightning, the other half in the Nighthawk - that way you have to buy both. So DIY is still the way to go on this.

Bear

Thanks BEAR for the response.

Chief I would love the info and especially a layout as well as a schematic, but like me its probably best to complete one project at a time. No stress. Probably would be good to post it when available and share with everyone on this forum.

BTW the JTM/Cheifton amp sounds interesting also. 6L6's, KT66 or EL34? I mistakenly bought a Matchless tranny that's for a Cheifton, but I'm going to try and drop the low voltage tap down to 360 volts by using two 5Y3's and build a 4 6V6 amp.

EL34s cathode biased on the JTM/Chieftain
Just tested last night. 25 clean watts, god only knows clipped..., pretty quiet, too..
But the PI clips before the '34s, so I'm going to try to get more headroom out of the PI or squash the 34's plate voltages...I want the 34's clipping w/ clean signal......
It sounds great dimed, but too much pre distortion for my taste...very bright, so I may have to cheat in a cap or two.....
I'll post the Drei Schicksale sch and layout when I get layout done.....

boo.......

_________________
the bastard son of Jack Parsons
http://www.rotten.com/library/bio/mad-s ... k-parsons/

Chief, You might consider lowering the drive from the pre-amp by substituting in a 5751 or a 12AY7. The lower gain pre-amp will also tone down some of that brightness. Pretty easy and quick.

Cal

'34s have too much headroom
I'm gonna cut their nuts off
and shave their heads
that'll teach em

let you know how it goes

Slaughter Haus 5

_________________
the bastard son of Jack Parsons
http://www.rotten.com/library/bio/mad-s ... k-parsons/

Greetings Fellow Earthlings,

1) I owned a DC-30 in the early-late 90s. It saw about 1000 dates when I was playing on the Left Coast of NoAmer. I tended to live in the EF86 channel, but rarely clicked the tone jobber after I dialed it in for my numero uno axe at the time (a PRS custom 24). It was a sooperfine sound, but I liked it better at 4xEL84 than 2xEL84, FWIW. The 4xEL84 recorded better, too.

2) I like the Trinity 15 better than the DC-30 "top boost" channel at 2xEL84. Can't say why, though. It just works better for me (N.B. I'm currently using guitars with P90, Tele, TV Jones, low output PAF and Strat pups with it mostly).

3) I'm not sure I miss the EF86 channel enough to trade my Trinity 15 for a DC-15. I'm not sure I'd want to add a EF86 2xEL84 amp to the roster without a Decent Reason.

4) Given (1), I don't understand (3), but ours is not to reason why...ours is but to stand and stare in mute astonishment. Or suchlike.

5) Smoke if you get one.

6) Esteban, I may get a license-free copy of a recent show with Brenda that was recorded for public radio and TV. I'm waiting on the "ok" from She Who Must Be Obeyed. Ifn so, you are welcome to them, as the Trinity 15 was featured on about half the numbers (and a cool 4xEL84 amp by Adam Stark on the other half). We'll see how it shakes out.

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Hasta --> Rico

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Earth is an asylum for angels with amnesia - Emerson

drrico,

Howdy! I guess skulez out. Great to see you jump in!

Which rectifier tube are you using these days? I know you started with the 5U4GB. It's cool to hear that your like the Trinity 15 better than the DC-30 "top boost" channel at 2xEL84 - even if you can't say why.

We've been talking about the EF86/DC-15 amp for a bit now. Don't think it's been made yet. Since you listened to your DC30 so many times, how would you characterize that channel's sound? Why would you want one? or not?

_________________
Stephen
Web: www.trinityamps.com. Facebook: facebook.com/trinityamps. Twitter: @trinityamps

Hmm. Preference of different preamps with different power sections. Very interesting. Especially since I'm intent on SE power sections, which might change the preferences again.

Bear

Been comparing the Lightning and DC-30 drawings. The biggest differance are the coupling caps that feed the power section. I'm thinking the DC-30 with the bigger caps will have the thicker sound. The lightning might be more chimey and not as thick sounding.

Probably the value of the coupling caps need to be considered when dialing in this amp.

BTW I'm building a HC-30/15, but maybey mid to late summer I'll begin assembling all the parts I ordered. I'm still tired and recovering from grad school.

Might be building a 30W Lightning for a customer. Maybe we can do this new one together? It will have to sound like a Lightning, but with twice the power for stage work.

_________________
Stephen
Web: www.trinityamps.com. Facebook: facebook.com/trinityamps. Twitter: @trinityamps